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Post by mrfuzzynutz on Mar 9, 2012 16:20:29 GMT -5
Many good point, so my thought process was to see where my guys would fit in to what already was started. So while I always believe you need a mix of power levels to make things interesting, to have some role players, and someone to cheer for.
So Savant is someone I created specifically for the group so he can be tweaked as need, or frankly replaced as well
Onyx was a favorite of mine for years, and Digi this is why I luv ya, he originally was named Blackstone, but I try to steer clear of a Black character having Black in his name...sort of like..Yeah he is Black I get it already lol
Cinder that is a shame, as I did not read radius's but you are correct, she would not make the cut But I think we need another powerhouse female though
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 9, 2012 16:28:20 GMT -5
I'm doing a female powerhouse style character for the team right now.
TBH, I like Cinder more than Radius actually. Sorry icecap. Maybe switch out Radius for Orbit? Orbit would be way more interesting.
Ha! That is too funny re:Onyx/Blackstone. Yeah, I understand avoiding a "Black" name for a black character. How about Obsidian instead of Onyx?
Assuming things go the ideal way, I think the team could end up as:
Omega Man Orbit Lady Mesmerize <Unnamed Female Powerhouse/Warrior> The Enforcer Thunderhead Savant Obsidian Cinder
But thats just IMO.
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Post by icecap on Mar 9, 2012 16:47:47 GMT -5
Lol i was just gonna ask if you guys needed me to move Radius. Ill place Radius in the Academy. But as for Orbit i want her to remain in the Academy as her backround has ties to the history. Ill switch out radius with Vanguard can't wait till i get to show you guys his costum.
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 9, 2012 16:51:48 GMT -5
In that case, give Vanguard some telekinesis style power, like magnetic control or gravity manipulation? It would help make him (or her) more unique from other powered armor characters.
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Post by icecap on Mar 9, 2012 17:12:42 GMT -5
Lady Mesmerize has mental/telekinesis powers. I was thinking about giving Vanguard a secondary powerset of Light.
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 9, 2012 17:18:16 GMT -5
Except a name like "Mesmerize" (should be "Mesmer" really) implies an emphasis on hypnosis and mind control, not psychokinesis.
Vanguard will be more interesting if he has an aspect emphasized that makes him stand out from generic powered armor characters.
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Post by mrfuzzynutz on Mar 9, 2012 22:30:57 GMT -5
Ok,,,To make Savant more offensive minded, perhaps we can equip him a back pack that adapts to his needs Tool, Offensice Weapons, a personal force field and a short range jet pack? if not a back pack, perhaps his suit will have the gadgets? Like Cap's Elctro Shield he sported for a few months awhile back
As a tech head he can always tweak his gear now and then, but keep a basic three "on board" abilities
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Post by icecap on Mar 9, 2012 22:36:42 GMT -5
Sounds good to me what does he like?
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Post by mrfuzzynutz on Mar 9, 2012 22:44:24 GMT -5
I was thinking terms of Superhero Boys Scout's lol what are the essentials for the non powered hero in the field Offense, Defense, and Transport
So I am thinking wrist laser sort of like a mix of Booster Gold and Iron Man's repulser rays a bio electric force bubble and a jet pack
His laser should pack some punch since he is a tech guy it should show what he can do, but not over powering that takes out a city block, but could cause a high level Brick to stop in his tracks
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Post by icecap on Mar 9, 2012 23:04:51 GMT -5
Gonna start from sratch for my guardian submissions. New characters are Daybreak and Poseidon. Daybreak powers are cosmic energy and Poseidons powers are water control.
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 9, 2012 23:19:10 GMT -5
Screw what their powers are, what are their concepts? Powers don't matter as long as you've got a solid concept.
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Post by mrfuzzynutz on Mar 10, 2012 2:02:55 GMT -5
Supreme, Superman, Sentry, Mr Majestic same powers..but it's their concept and what they do that make them different The power is what they do, the character and backstory is who they are
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 10, 2012 11:40:09 GMT -5
Thats my point Fuzz. Concepts before powers. Icecap seems to constantly focus on the powers, as if the powers define the character more than anything. Oh, so Poseidon is a water controller? Daybreak is a cosmic energy controller? That tells us nothing about who these characters are or anything. There's no concept there at all, just a name and powerset.
Also Fuzz, your analogy is flawed a bit. One of things that made Supreme and Mr. Majestic work so well was because they WERE Superman, but without the restrictions on Superman as a character.
The thing here is that we're trying to start off a universe with its own identity, and the less beholden we are to the ideas of the big two, the better. I prefer the way Marvel went with doing Superman in its setting: splitting the character into Thor and Captain America. Thor, who still manages to hold the same role of flying brick powerhouse while being RADICALLY different, and Captain America, who embodies Superman's iconicism and symbolism.
So if we want to model our "Superman" off something, I'd rather it be something that wasn't, y'know, Superman with a different coat of paint. Thats the easy and lazy way out.
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 10, 2012 12:00:03 GMT -5
Basically, my point is that sure, I'm cool with a "Superman" on the team, but only if he's not a straight up copy like Supreme or Mr. Majestic are. I'd rather the character be something that has indirect parallels to Superman, rather than direct parallels.
Examples are, besides the aforementioned Thor/Captain America duality, characters like the current Nova, Captain Atom (Preboot/Post-Crisis), Gilgamesh the Forgotten One (or Ikaris, both from The Eternals), the Champions RPG's Defender, or the original/Tangeant Superman. I'm not saying directly copy these characters, but these are just examples of how flexible the Superman concept can be. There's no need to stick closely to it. As long as the character has the definitive flying brick powerset in some form or another and has that Superman style iconic aura, the character can definitely be the Superman. Heck, if you want characters who skew more closely to the mold while still being very different, there's always The Sentry or Captain Marvel/Miracleman or Namor the Submariner or Samaritan from Astro City.
Point is, be imaginative and create, don't just copy.
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Post by icecap on Mar 11, 2012 19:31:01 GMT -5
Ill start on their backrounds now, also can you add Prophet to the academy roster
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 11, 2012 20:24:00 GMT -5
Done. I'm also going to split the Young Guardians off from the rest of GISHA's student body. Lets cap the YG off at 12 members, and any future GISHA students will be undergraduates.
The Young Guardians acting as a stepping stone between graduation from the Academy and membership in the GGU.
So I recommend trimming things a bit with YG characters.
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Post by icecap on Mar 12, 2012 11:58:22 GMT -5
I was gonna make the cap for them 15. Not larger then the x-men but bigger then the new young justice team. There are still some holes im trying to fill within the team so i need the extra 3 members. I meen if you think about it the GISHA student body is going to be hundreds, 15 out of that isn't really that large at all.
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 12, 2012 12:28:55 GMT -5
I suppose fifteen would be okay, three teams of five within the group.
Here's the thing though: how many of those hundreds of students are gonna be named, hm? You really gonna create more students than YG members? You really going to place more emphasis on them than the YG?
Really, the number of characters created for the YG versus for the GISHA will definitely demonstrate the true priorities here. You just want your own Young Justice. I want something far greater and more special than just that.
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Post by icecap on Mar 12, 2012 13:36:56 GMT -5
Ya exactly three teams of five. And no I’m not going to name hundreds of the GISHA students, example at the Xavier instute there are far more unnamed students than just the X-men. Im trying to build an Academy for the Guardians that train all origins of students alien, magic, mutants, and everyday normal teens. (this has never been done before) That’s why the Young Guardian roster is so high, so i can blend all of those origins into one team. This will also insure the future Guardians a well balance.
The characters from young justice all have ties to their mentors (relatives, sidekicks etc) Members from the Young Guardians are all handpicked by the people that founded it. These are the students that are basically shoe-ins to become future Guardian members. It's like the global unity gets a new group of members every year or so. The only reason i said i needed robin/artemis type characters was because ive all ready created the mutants/alien/ and magic types for the team. This is far greater than just a bunch of heroes with sidekicks. The young guardians in a way are bigger then gisha because these are the students that will one day replace the guardians.
And the only reason i said the team needed a leader because every team has one. I didn't mean a leader like Charles Xavier. I was meaning a team leader like for separate missions. The perfect example for what i was trying to say would be Cyclops.
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Post by icecap on Mar 12, 2012 13:45:43 GMT -5
As far as Omega Man is concerend I don't see how you say he is a copy. Ive never posted his bio or powers yet because i was still working on them. You said he was a copy based on the fact that he has a cape and wears tights. I was planning on making his powers revolve around energy hint the name Omega. The only reason i listed the replacements powers first was so i could give you guys a view, so we would know what we have on the team.
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 12, 2012 14:23:17 GMT -5
And you know one of the reasons Grant Morrisson's run was so good? Cause he actually bothered to focus on that part of the Institute, one that writers had repeatedly neglected, and would be neglected up until Kyle and Yost's run on New X-Men.
An academy like this is the perfect place to break away from mere superheroics and take a look at what an academy of young superhumans would be like, away from all that. Focusing on the more standard "young superhero" team over that is a crying shame, since there are so many more possibilities in that realm.
All immaterial, since you keep bringing up Young Justice as a source of inspiration. Think outside the box, expand your horizons. The very fact that you said you wanted a "Robin and Artemis" type characters exemplifies that. If you want non-powered characters, sure, thats fine, but think outside the box of Young Justice.
*needs a facepalm emoticon*
Really? The Young Guardians wouldn't exist without the Academy. The Academy isn't *just* the YG. To say that the YG is bigger than the rest of GISHA would be an insult to the staff and student body of the Academy, as if every student doesn't matter. "Yes Johnny, you are special, just not as special as those Young Guardians, cause you decided you'd rather live a normal life with your powers than become a superhero." The whole point of the Academy is to raise those kids with powers, regardless of whether they want to be a hero or not. Some just want to be civilians, to be a lawyer, a doctor, have a small business of their own, or use their powers for far more "mundane" purposes. Being a hero is just an option, never more important than anything else. You are not chosen to become one, you choose to be one. The only outside input is whether you are eligible or not.
I may just have to create a villain for the express purpose of demonstrating why the thing you just said is so expressly elitist and hateful.
Except thats not what the three GGU leaders of the YG would be like. They would be actual field leaders for this time, not a mere "guide" like Xavier was. Sure, they would appoint a YG member to take point based on a given situation, but never as a permanent leader. The point is to allow everyone a chance to develop and grow, to find their comfort zone and grow in their strengths while improving on their weaknesses. That doesn't mean there wouldn't be members that are leaders in spirit and personality, just that there won't be an official kid who is the leader. The GGU members are the official leaders, on and off the field.
No, I say that because you told me right from the start, and your further descriptions reinforced that. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it probably is a duck.
...
There's absolutely no correlation between energy style powers and the letter "Omega." Omega is the final letter of the Greek alphabet, signifying an end, the ultimate, the pinnacle, finality. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end.
In the context of the character as known, Omega indicates his status as one of the best heroes, a legendary icon. He is powerful, not just powerful, but so powerful there is nothing like him. And that puts him above other men. That's what his name signifies, in lieu of anything sensical to the contrary. Its yet another aspect of the character that indicates a Superman-analogue.
Then wait and give us something more than just "This is X and he can do Y." Give us a concept, a feel for what this character is like. Fuzzy gave us a basic, simple idea of what each of his characters were like, more than just a power and a name. Even though they were simple and very sketchy, it gave us an idea of what these characters were like. Sure they weren't completely defined, but at least we had concepts to latch onto beyond a name and a power. You have an obsession with powers as a way of defining a character first and foremost, exemplified with the way you have asked what powers some of my characters have to the exemption of any other aspect of them.
Powers are a part of a character, but not everything. They are flavor, like sugar in cold cereal. Without a decent, solid concept, the character is just one of countless innumerable blank slates that will fall into the pit of oblivion.
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Post by icecap on Mar 12, 2012 14:33:13 GMT -5
I was trying to combine both of are ideas for the academy but i failed. Explain your idea to me again
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 12, 2012 14:51:57 GMT -5
First off, let me apologize for my rancor in the previous post. As much as I can seem to be disagreeable, I really just have an intense passion for worldbuilding, and don't have patience for what I percieve to be unoriginality and an inability to fully exploit a concept. If I hurt you in any way, I apologize.
That out of the way...
Essentially, I forsee the GISHA academy as an international school for superhumans on Earth. The Young Guardians, who are GISHA's flagship organization, is a joint program between the Academy and the GGU to train those students who express a desire to be superheroes. It is not exclusively for the Academy, as non-powered wannabe heroes can join, although they must demonstrate eligability.
If an undergraduate at the Academy expresses a desire to be a superhero, the Young Guardians program society becomes their primary academic program, and all of their courses beyond general education are specifically tailored for that program. However, in order to become a member of the Young Guardians, you must graduate from the Academy. Essentially, the YG is kind of like a graduate school for superheroes, with graduation giving that student a liscense to become a superhero and an opportunity to join the ranks of the GGU.
Everything is about eligability. A promising student may be reccommended for the Young Guardians program even if their have not declared interest in becoming a hero, but at the end of the day it is their choice.
The Young Guardians varies in number. Membership in it can last up to a few years, though a member can graduate early if one of the program's leaders believes that student is ready. It is an opportunity for would-be heroes to practice everything they have learned at the Academy in the field, an opportunity to stop crime and save the world. It is led by three select members of the GGU, whose job it is to train, mentor, and lead the students through the program. There are no official student leaders; the members must demonstrate leadership through example and initiative, not because of appointment. However, during certain missions the GGU members will assign a particular student to lead their group in order to help further that individual's training. Students who take charge and demonstrate competency in working with their peers can help accelerate their graduation from the Young Guardians program.
Thats basically my idea for both GISHA and the Young Guardians right there. I may be leaving things out, but if I remember I will be sure to write it down.
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Post by icecap on Mar 12, 2012 17:47:11 GMT -5
Its ok i just got a little confused with the direction of were it was going this post helped alot. So we will go with this idea for the Academy. Ill start working on the staff tonight.
And for the Guardians as far as team needs what are we missing so i can try to fill the holes?
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 12, 2012 18:11:58 GMT -5
Cool. I do have a few ideas for GISHA staff myself, but lets see what you've got first.
Far as Guardians go...
Are you keeping Omega Man? Or are we sticking with Daybreak and Poseidon? And what are the concepts for those characters? Daybreak sounds like he has potential to be more of an unconventional Superman type, and with a name like Poseidon, I imagine that character as being Thor by way of Aquaman, but thats just me reading into those characters.
As for the others, we've got:
Lady Mesmerize (Psychic of some sort) <Unnamed Female Powerhouse/Warrior> (She's basically like Durga) The Enforcer (Enhanced Supersoldier, Hi-Tech Weaponry) Thunderhead (Weather Controller) Savant (Tech Genius, Gadgeteer) Obsidian (Superstrong Stone Form) Cinder (Fiery Blaster)
Y'know, a speedster, mystic, or shapeshifter would add a bit of variety.
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 14, 2012 9:25:45 GMT -5
Okay, got a name for my female powerhouse: Mighty Lioness.
I am quite pleased with myself right now.
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Post by mrfuzzynutz on Mar 17, 2012 21:09:45 GMT -5
Hmmm...How about we just call her Lioness.. Like does anyone call Spider-Man..The Amazing Spider-Man, or the Invincible Iron Man?
I assume their is some feline attributes to her because a female with jungle cat abilities is full of potential
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 18, 2012 13:07:16 GMT -5
Um, dude, I've got a bio for her up already. You can check it out in the character bios forum. Anyway, "Lioness" is a boring single word name. Afterall, would you take the "Wonder" out of "Wonder Woman"? "Woman" is a rather boring superheroine name. Secondly, no, she is not a jungle cat heroine. The "Lioness" part has more to do with her symbolism and character. At most, the armor/weapons she summons have a leonine design to them. You're thinking too literally.
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Post by icecap on Mar 18, 2012 15:45:57 GMT -5
Her look and bio are great but im kind of on fuzzys side when it comes to her name
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Post by BS Digital Q on Mar 18, 2012 15:48:54 GMT -5
Aaaaaand I already explained why that complaint doesn't hold water.
"Mighty Tigress" might sound better, but it also would remove any connotations between her association with African activities. So Mighty Lioness it is. No ifs, ands, or buts.
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